Stephen: How’s it going, Muhammad?
Muhammad: It’s going good. Thanks for having me.
Stephen: Yeah, I know there’s some exciting stuff going on in your life.
I just saw that video with your new podcasting server. And I thought that, yeah, to be honest, I thought that was an epic video.
Muhammad: There’s a lot of work that’s been on that specific video. So since you are also a content creator, you can understand how much work goes into creating such a type of content. So that was a lot of hard work. I’m glad it paid off.
Stephen: No, and just like the way you guys were bouncing back and forth on each other.
How long did that take to put that video together?
Muhammad: It took about two days of shooting and then it was like two days of editing. We try to make it feel like a live conversation in which two guys are sitting on one sofa.
So if you have noticed that, one guy has his right hand on the sofa and then the other guy has his left hand on the sofa. Make it feel natural. Two guys sitting on one sofa and then talking to an interviewer. So we try to depict that and it really turned out really well.
So grateful for that.
Stephen: Yeah. Sometimes I think when you do those kinds of videos that introduce a new product and you’re telling your story, sometimes when it’s one person it’s harder to not come across as kind of egotistical.
But when you’ve got two people with such a cool story, it tends to flow a lot better.
So was that, you that did it, obviously you guys collaborate on it, but did you lead the work on that? Is that stuff that you already do with what you’ve been doing in your digital marketing or…
Muhammad: Okay. Things are going in such a way that I am the chief operating officer of Podify and Billy Samoa Saleebey is the chief executive officer. So he deals with all the legalities, the business development, and I operate the business here. And I take care of the team. I take care of the operations. So that’s how our company Podify is working at the moment. And it’s very exciting. Cause we both have different talents.
We both bring multiple things on the table and that’s what makes this partnership, this collaboration a bit more strong one, because we both have different things to collaborate on. I think those different things compliment really well. That’s why it feels really good to have Billy on board, on this journey, because he has this huge experience of sales and business developments.
And so he has been working with the great minds in Tesla and SolarCity. So he knows how to communicate in the market. And I have been working with the operations. I had my software company as well, so I know how the operations are, how to manage teams and how the work goes on.
So that’s how we actually compliment the things and that’s how things started rolling on.
Stephen: Yeah. That’s awesome, man. Yeah, It’s actually really exciting for you, especially for you guys. I think it’s cool. It’s also a testament to LinkedIn. That’s how we met. We just interacted through content, our videos and stuff, and that’s how we got this rolling. But then you guys, yeah, but then you guys, have an even more impressive story.
You guys literally formed a partnership and you started a business, you started a whole new product, and you guys were an ocean away. So I think that’s a huge testament.
Muhammad: You picked that line, you picked that line. Yeah, cause I think this is the beauty of this platform because it helps you connect with people around the world who speak different languages, who belong to different demographics.
And this is the beauty of this platform that it is, you can say, it’s a ‘no judgment’ land for people. Where anybody can have their opinions, where anybody can share their ideas. And there is no one to judge you. And there are, I actually feel that people on LinkedIn, they actually have a big heart and they’re really, they really help you succeed.
They really help you get up the ladder. And that’s how me and Billy met, on this platform, as exactly me and you met over here, that was over a piece of content where we both engaged on a piece of content and then, further on we exchanged our contact details.
And today here we are. So I think it’s a really amazing platform and people should really use it to build relationships rather than looking for get rich quick schemes and pitching people and disturbing those people. That’s really not why LinkedIn, what LinkedIn is meant for.
LinkedIn is basically meant for relationships and long-term friendships, which actually translates to more business opportunities. And, that’s how things start sailing. Cause quick things, they don’t work. Slow and steady wins the race always. And that’s what exactly LinkedIn is meant for.
Stephen: Yeah. Yeah. I totally agree. And it’s also funny too because I ran into, I connected with your partner just a few days before you guys released the video. And that was totally by accident. And it just, yeah, sometimes I’m just like, man it’s just weird how that works. That’s why that video hit me like a ton of bricks because I just connected with him.
And then you guys have this new product. I was like, that’s so awesome.
Muhammad: The world is a round place and you get people bouncing into each other. And that’s exactly what it is.
Stephen: Yeah. You guys obviously believe in, yeah, you guys obviously believe in podcasting. You guys are creating a whole product around that.
I’m helping people think that stuff through as well and helping them think through how to do content and distribute that stuff. So what do you think the opportunities are for people going forward with podcasting in particular?
Muhammad: I think it’s a great opportunity for people who have just started, or maybe who are already doing, or maybe people who think to start a podcast.
Cause you know people have recently, because recently according to recent studies more than 54% people now listen to a podcast. So that makes me think that if we have always been consuming video content in terms of YouTube or different streaming platforms, Twitch, maybe. So why not podcasts?
Why not audio? Because audio has, you can say, through audio content, there is a specific connection that really connects you with the host and the guest while you’re listening to a podcast. And I really think that podcasting has a great potential from now on, and it has already been a potential within podcasts.
Cause you know, people like Jordan Harbinger who have been into podcasting worlds since 2006 and now, after a decade and a half, they agree that podcasting is something which takes a lot of time. But when it takes time and when you know it helps you develop the skills,
Then it’s really fruitful. And I really think that people should start podcasting, even if they’re talking about just cars or maybe just one specific car in general, or maybe anything they like. So that’s how the podcasting thing is.
Because you know it’s something like, when you start speaking, when you start sharing your ideas, what happens is eventually you start collecting your own tribe and people, you try, you start attracting those people and eventually when you share your thoughts, when you speak out of your heart, people who you’re attracting, they try to,
They resonate with you and once they start resonating with you, they become your online tribe members or your online family members. So in this way, I think that builds and that creates a real community, like a virtual community and that’s what helps you to grow in terms of your business, your personal brand, your authority.
So it’s sure podcasting has a lot of potential and I would definitely suggest each and every one of the people who are listening to the show to definitely go create a podcast show for themselves.
Stephen: Yeah, no, totally. And I also think that sometimes even the word podcast can be a loaded word because you can do lots of different things. Like you can record workshops, like I’m recording this as video, but I’ll pull the audio out and publish that. But then I can put the video on my website. I can put that on YouTube.
So there’s a lot of different, actually, there’s a lot of different things you can actually publish and then, yeah,
And then also what you mentioned, like the skills. So what I notice now is there’s so many new skills to learn and so many new skills that people are deploying and the people that are getting into that now, yeah, they may not be masters, but they’re actually starting to develop those skills.
And then over time, they’re going to get better and better. But there’s a whole group of people that are in a little bit more of a traditional space. They’re just there. They’re continuing to do business the same way, which is, I’m not saying it’s a bad thing. It’s like networking and referrals and all that kind of stuff is great.
But they’re not learning those basic skills, which I consider basic skills at this point. Or they will be shortly. So do you have a lot of people who are just, “Oh, there’s already podcasts that talk about that. Oh, there’s already… I’m not going to be able to get that many subscribers,” or whatever that is.
Sometimes I’m just, “Hey, you need to start to develop these skills. Just so that you’re not left behind.”
Muhammad: Exactly. Exactly. Cause you know, okay. I just want to address this last thing that you mentioned, you know about the subscribers because I really believe that if anybody is doing anything for subscribers or for the follower count or the number of likes or comments they get, I personally think that they are actually losing.
Because they are just judging themselves based on the number of likes they get on a single post they put on social media. Because that’s not the way you look at it. If you really want to share what’s inside of you, what thoughts you have, you just have to be very natural.
You have to be yourself and you have to forget about everything else. You have to forget about what other people are talking about you, what they say about you, the number of likes you get. Even if you could just get one single, you should be grateful for that, that one person, one person, your thoughts actually resonated with that one person.
So you should start sharing the things. Eventually what will happen is you will develop a tribe who resonates with your tone, your style, your personality, because let’s put it this way. We as human beings, we are brand ambassadors of ourselves. Because there is no one like yours, right?
We are unique and we are our own brand. So even if people say that, “Oh, there’s a podcast already on this specific topic, there are a ton of podcasts already there who are talking on this specific topic.” So the point to mention is, the personality factor.
Maybe, let’s say, there are thousand thousand podcasts out there talking about a topic A. But let’s say you also talk about that topic A. But maybe you have that specific sense of humor that people really like.
So what will happen is eventually, yeah 999 podcasts, people will not listen to those and people will listen to yours just because of the sense of humor you have. And the others don’t have that.
This is just because of your personality. That’s all. It’s not about, ‘It’s already been done.’ ‘They already have a million subscribers.’ That does not matter. You just need to start, you just need to. Share your thoughts and that’s it. Just forget about the things and just share your thoughts and just be consistent with it.
Stephen: Yeah, I think that was a great point that you mentioned, especially with the likes and comments and stuff. Because I’ll admit, even for myself, there are times where I get a little bit too caught up in that as I’ve started to get into this journey. Where I’ve realized that the best way to handle it is just to come in, have a list of things that you need to do, do them well, but not get so caught up in that.
I think I see kind of two spectrums. I see people that are just starting out sharing their ideas. They tend to, it’s they’re just getting going. So they’re really invested in these things that they’re doing. So I see it’s very easy for them to get overly attached to some of those things, but then on the other spectrum, more with businesses that are more mature and they’re already successful in their own space,
And they’re trying to get into social media. Sometimes they take it too lightly. They come in and they just post links to blogs and stuff like that. And they’re not really engaging in the platform. And it’s really like having a balance. It’s coming in and delivering good content, like being present there.
Not just checking the box, but then not getting too overly invested in it either. Just, almost like having a Zen balance. Zen perspective of…
Muhammad: Oh yes, absolutely. Because you know being, running a marketing agency, we have seen this. A lot of businesses, they just want their blogs to be out there on your social media platform and they don’t want to invest their own time to engage with their audience.
And if you just visit their social media pages, they really feel like a sad robot. I mean, they’re just creating content on autopilot and that’s just being posted at the specific time, specific date, cause all of that is scheduled and nothing is being, feeling natural. Because people know that, okay, on Friday 10:00 AM, that’s going to be there and nobody’s going to engage with it because It’s normal.
It’s really important for brands and businesses, even brick and mortar businesses to actually engage with their audience, actually make them feel that you are present, make them feel that you actually care about them because humans are really emotional creatures.
And if you engage with them and if you show them respect, if you show them value, you give them value. They’re trying to reciprocate in the same manner. I’m not saying everybody does the same, but most of the people do the same. So that’s how it works.
Stephen: Yeah, no, totally. And then one other thing that I’ve found that’s so cool about podcasting that I didn’t necessarily think about at first. It just makes it very easy for me to reach out to people and create conversations with them.
Muhammad: Yeah, 100%.
Stephen: Yeah. Because if I would reach out to them before, they were like, what does this guy want?
What is he trying to sell me? But now I’m realizing, Hey, I can actually just invite successful people that I’d even like to work with and start a really cool conversation with them. Learn about their business, learn about their struggles, in a non-sales situation.
And just turn that switch off and just be like, Hey let’s chat. And then after the fact I can send them video clips of themselves talking so that they can post on social media. And so me and them are sitting right next to each other. It’s going out to their channels. So it’s something you can really distribute if you think about it carefully.
You can really provide them a lot of value, create conversations that you normally would never be able to create. And then also help distribute your name as well.
Muhammad: Exactly. That’s really true. I have actually learned this specific trick from my partner Billy. He actually told me how he reaches out to different podcasters and maybe, how he gets more, more different guests.
He uses this specific thing that, whenever he wants to invite someone to be a guest on his podcast show, what he does is very simple. He reaches out to those people in a very conversational manner and then tries to talk and have a little conversation.
And then he tells them that, Hey, I have a podcast show and I’d love you to be a guest on my show. So here’s a thing, he actually told me that, first there was, or you can say a resistance, but when you actually tell those people that, “Hey, if you’re going to be a guest on my podcast, so in return, I could give video clips.”
So of you talking just as you said, or maybe the podcast show. So maybe, just making the distribution easy for those people. It actually makes them feel that, yeah. If they are going to be on the show, it’s actually going to benefit them long-term because they are going to get exposure.
They’re going to get media. So that’s a way if you’re trying to approach people for podcasts. So yeah. It really makes the whole journey really easier.
Stephen: Yeah. I’ve had people reach out to me after the fact and they were just almost blown away that I would go to that length.
I will say though, I will say, that getting the processes in place to actually deliver on that takes a little bit of experience. And that’s the fun thing that I’ve been doing, too, is developing all the processes and the skills to do that. Just cause you’re doing it week in and week out and it has to go off like clockwork. What I will say is, the hard part is just figuring it out.
Once you get into a rhythm, it’s not actually that hard. It doesn’t actually take that much time
Stephen: Like the person making the clips, I would say the hardest part actually is who has the skill to decide what the good clip is.
Muhammad: Oh, yes, absolutely. Because you know, you have an hour-long episode and then you have to skim through it to find the best part.
And then, just take out the best parts of it. That’s really a challenge. I completely agree with that.
Stephen: Yeah. And then also like figuring out like, what words do you want to start on so that it comes in…
Muhammad: Yeah, exactly. And it’s so funny. Because this evening we were actually working on a video.
So what happened was, we had a bunch of video clips sorted out and we were just trying to figure out what headings should be on top of the video for each clip. That’s also a challenge.
Stephen: That is. Yeah. Yeah. And then also, what do you write? Because what I’ve found is, like what you’ve seen in my one-off videos where I’m just giving a very particular message,
Those are pretty easy because I can pretty much copy, what I put above the video can pretty much match what I say line for line, because it’s just a message. But what I found with podcasting is you have to, sometimes the clip of the podcast is not a complete idea all the time.
It’s not a complete sentence. Because it may be 30 seconds or 90 seconds of somebody talking, but you’re not getting everything. So in that case, you can’t just copy what was said. You have to go in and articulate maybe a more complete idea that gives people the bigger picture.
And then you’re right. That title has to be something that catches people’s eye. Because people can be lazy. They can be lazy.
I see one person that’s doing this one thing a lot.( I always provide free advice when people want it.) But I noticed that the title of all of his videos is always the name of his podcast.
Muhammad: That’s awesome. That’s awesome.
Stephen: I was gonna say, it’s awesome. At the same time, it doesn’t always capture, it’s better to talk about what that clip is going to be about versus it just being the name of your podcast. Because when people are scrolling through the feed, what is going to get them to stop?
And so the title has to be something interesting to somebody. If I were just to say, digital masters podcast, every single time, then the videos just don’t get as much. They just don’t get seen as much because people don’t know why they would even watch it.
Because there’s a very clear reason behind it, because it’s human nature. When you see things again and again, you get numb to that specific thing. And what happens is even if that is appearing on your feed, your brain tells you that you have already seen that and you just scroll past it.
So if you actually give your audience a hook through your headline, that could be a great investment for you. Cause you know, that’s something which actually grabs the attention of your audience and that actually makes them intrigued about the video, like the content, what is in there.
And one of the things that I really appreciate about your content is whenever you post videos, instead of watching the videos entirely, if somebody is just reading the copy, they get the complete gist of what’s in the video. I really like this idea. Cause you know, I have noticed this thing that whenever people are trying to put out video content, either the copy is just a summary, or sometimes it’s just the heading, but not the complete idea.
But if you’re posting video content…, because this is a fact: people have different types of learning behaviors and by learning behaviors, what I mean is some people, they perceive knowledge by video. Some people by audio, some people by reading, right?
So we need to provide flexibility of learning so that whoever the audience is, they get to learn. They get to learn about the message that you want to deliver through their own preferred medium. That could be either a video and audio or maybe copy.
The idea is to provide flexibility for your audience to do, to let them understand your message more clearly in their specific way.
Stephen: Yeah, totally. Yeah. And it’s interesting. Because people have told me that specifically in comments, they’ll be like, “Hey, I’m glad that you also include the text.” I’ve been on the receiving end of that too.
I’ll see somebody’s video and it’s five minutes long and I’m like, I don’t know, that’s a long time to invest.
And yeah, here’s another interesting thing too, is that I take my podcasts and I also transcribe them. And so when I post the video on my website, I’ll also put the transcription below it and I’ve had several people reach out to me and they said they appreciated the transcription.
Not because they read every word, but they were able to skim through it pretty quickly and find some of the nuggets that they were interested in.
Muhammad: Absolutely. And putting a complete transcript, like a complete timestamp transcript on your website, it also helps you with SEO, because search engine optimization, right?
Because let’s say you guys were, let’s say you were talking with the person on your podcast. And then you guys were discussing a specific link about a specific resource or maybe your personal website, right? So let’s say you were talking about your website, like for instance, www.inandoutdigital.com or www.podify.co .
When we speak about this, this actually gets into the transcript. And when that transcript gets onto your website, Google’s crawlers, they get to learn about that specific link. And when somebody tries to search for that website, and if your blog is already having a good domain authority, it actually helps Google to find that specific person, specific guest or a specific website even more easily.
So that’s why search engine optimization specialists always recommend, if you’re creating YouTube content, always put transcripts over there. Or maybe always put your captions over there and make sure that your captions are not burned into the video. That means the captions being animated within the video, because that is a good user experience, but that is not good in terms of search engine optimization, because Google won’t get that.
But Google will get it when you specifically upload that dot SRT ( .SRT ) file, which contains your captions, or maybe your transcript starts, then it allows Google to read those transcripts and get the information out of those.
So that’s something that really helps podcasters in ranking their websites and getting their domains and in getting their websites authority up by having more and more conversations with influential people.
Let’s say you interviewed a guest who really has a very good reputation, right? And that guest is being searched on Google quite often. So you have their name on your podcast show and you keep on having this conversation and you keep on talking their name.
So that name is registered on that specific SRT and the transcript. So what will eventually happen is, when people are trying to search for that specific guest on Google, and if your website is up with SEO and your website is good with SEO, so it might happen that Google crawls your website.
So in this way, through just through your guests, your website is getting that link juice, eventually creating more opportunities for you and your business. So that’s how beautiful podcasting is.
Stephen: Yeah. Yeah. There’s a lot to think about man. And there’s all these different ways that like all these things get connected.
Muhammad: Of course.
Stephen: I love talking about podcasting, especially since I’m doing it and you guys are doing it too. Originally when we talked, we were going to be talking about paid ads and stuff.
So let me ask you a quick question. So you guys are releasing this brand new product. Do you envision running ads right away or do you feel like you have to get some organic attraction first?
How do you, when you start thinking about ads for a brand new product like this, how are you guys already talking about this internally?
Muhammad: That’s a very good question. Very clearly we actually are. We actually envision getting organic reach first because it’s very important to build authority and it’s very important to make Google feel good about your website.
Because seeing it in easy terms, it’s very important to get traffic ahead of time on your website so that Google gets to know that your domain is not dormant and your domain is actually getting some traffic.
So let’s say if you are promoting your content organically, and if people are actually getting to your website, searching for your website on Google, what happens is the crawlers of Google, like the crawlers of Google’s are called, (you can say the robots of Google) they get an idea that, okay, this specific website is worth their time, it’s worth people’s attention.
So they try to grab information from cookies about that specific website. And eventually with time, what happens is when organic traffic increases and after that, you’re trying to run paid ads,
Number one, you have already built an authority. What will happen is for instance, if you’re running paid ads after building authority through organic content, people resonate with the content that they see on the paid ads, as well as if they already see that, okay, this is a kind of a brand that they already have seen before.
That also makes sense. On the other hand, let’s say, if we just launched and we started paid advertisement, it will do just one thing and it will do it greatly. That is, waste your dollars, right?
Yeah. Because it’s very true that if nobody knows you and you’re trying to run ads, people cannot try to connect with you. So that’s the thing. If they land on your website and the website is completely blank, there is nothing, no testimonials, no reviews, nothing, why would they trust in you?
Why would they even sign up for your newsletter? Why would they do it? So it’s always good to first create some organic traffic. And once you have that traction, maybe just a little bit, and then if you try to run paid ads in your remarketing campaigns, that’s most fruitful for people and businesses.
Stephen: Maybe even starting off with retargeting because they came to your…if you’re going to start with paid ads, they actually came to your website first, and then you retarget so that when they start browsing around again, they keep seeing you. But they’ve already seen you.
I have seen that a little bit on LinkedIn. I’ve come across a few people and then I went to their website and then all of a sudden I saw them all over the place, but it was because I went to their website first. They didn’t target me with a… I’m pretty sure they didn’t target me with a paid ad.
Cause you know, what they say is, the real wealth lies within follow-ups, right? So it’s the same kind of concept over here. For instance, if somebody visited a specific website without them marketing it, what will eventually happen is, if the marketer behind that specific product or business is smart enough,
They will definitely create a remarketing campaign in which you know… remarketing campaign. Okay. So let’s put it in easy words for the audience. Remarketing campaign is basically, you take a bucket. And then you put those specific people in that bucket who actually visited your website at some point in time.
So now what your job as a marketer is to be on top of their minds. And that does not mean to annoy them by being present like every single time on every single page. I don’t mean that. I actually mean that, even if you have a bucket full of people who actually went to your website, it’s always smart to hyper-target your audience.
And by hyper-targeting, what I mean is specifically target people according to their likes and dislikes. In this way, let’s say you are a coffee-making company. You are a coffee brewing company, right? And then you get, let’s say a thousand people in your remarketing bucket, but let’s say 900 people out of those thousand people, they don’t like coffee.
And now if you’re trying to remarket them, it will do two things: a) waste your dollars and b) annoy those people. So it’s very smart that you hyper-target your audience. So let’s say you have a thousand people in your remarketing bucket.
But it’s smart to not target all of those people, but it’s smart to target a chunk of those people who actually like coffee and then try to market those people that want different types of coffees you have.
What is your process of brewing the coffee? What is your process of production? What is your process of actually completing the cleaning and processing of that, and how does it smell? What’s the color look like? Once you have the people who actually like coffee, then your job is to show those people different aspects of your product or service.
And then again, if you let’s say, if you have a targeted list of people and if you’re trying to show them the same thing again and again, they’ll eventually get bored and they will either block you or they’ll either star you, or maybe they’ll flag you because you’re just being annoying.
So it’s always good, even if you have a targeted list of people, try to show different aspects, like from different angles and from different perspectives. If you have a targeted group, try to hyper-target within that specific group.
Let’s say based on the age, demographics. Let’s say, wise people like different things. They like calm things, peaceful, polite. While if you talk about the young people, the teenagers, they like energetic things, rock and pop music in the background, something like that.
It’s all about the perspective. It’s all about how you think about people.
It’s always good as a marketer to think being in the shoes of your audience and once you are there you actually try to feel what it would feel like if I saw this specific ad. Once you try to feel in that way, it actually gives you a perspective on how you should proceed with your ads.
And in this way, the most successful ads are the ones who are hyper-targeted to their audience. In this way, those ads don’t feel like ads. They feel like real content. And that’s the beauty of targeting.
Stephen: Yeah. Yeah. It’s interesting. Like marketing really is the key to it, just understanding how the other person is actually feeling about all these things. Cause like we all think we know. Almost every business owner I meet, they think they know their customers really well.
But usually, they only know it from their own perspective. They see it from their skill. They don’t necessarily. They actually have no real idea of why the person actually is buying from them specifically.
Muhammad: Exactly. Exactly. And it’s really important to get to know your audience and get to know why they buy from you and what makes them feel to buy from you because it’s really important to get to know that feeling.
I would say, get to know that feeling when your customers either buy from you or maybe when your customers put their trust in you. You have to try to understand that feeling. What do they feel when they do or when they take those specific steps? So in this way, you will be more well aware of your business and of yourself.
And in this way, you’d have a good question to improve your services, your product, and overall customer experience. And this will result in better performance, better business, more reach, and more visibility.
Stephen: Yeah. Cool man. So I feel like we could talk about this stuff for ages. But why don’t you let people know what you’re up to, and how they can get a hold of you?
Muhammad: Of course they can connect with me on LinkedIn, which is LinkedIn slash mumarmoin. And they can also reach out to me through email, which is [email protected] , which is Umar at in and out digital.com .
Stephen: Cool man. And so you’re basically doing two things right now.
You’re doing the podcast stuff. And then you’re also continuing with digital marketing.
Muhammad: Exactly. So I’m running two companies right now, In and Out Digital ( inandoutdigital.com ), as well as Podify.
Stephen: That’s awesome. It’s a lot on your plate.
All right. Cool, man. Hey, I appreciate it. It’s been nice. I’m glad that we met on LinkedIn. I knew we would become friends and I truly appreciate you coming on to the podcast today and explaining your perspective on all these different things. And I look forward to continuing to talk with you in the future.
Muhammad: Absolutely. Absolutely. It was a pleasure being on here. And thank you so much for inviting me. I really appreciate that. And let’s just keep in touch and let’s just keep on engaging with the content that we’d produced. And I really appreciate you, creating content.
The fact that I love your videos is, I just mentioned within the show, that we don’t have to watch the entire video. The whole idea is within the copy. And that’s the thing that I really love about your content.
Stephen: Cool, man.
I appreciate that feedback. Have a good one.
Muhammad: Awesome. You too, have a good one. Bye. Take care.
Reach out to Muhammad: